Wednesday, March 11, 2009

Religion and gay sex don't get along


This graph from Gallup shows a universal tension between religion and homosexual sex. The disapproval does vary--Hindus, for example, don't feel as strongly as Muslims--but if homosexual rights were a high priority for me, I'd wish for a secular world.

Even non-Abrahamic religions are less tolerant than secularists. This across-the-board opposition to gay sex suggests a biological basis, doesn't it? Could it be as simple as the widespread revulsion that heteros feel at the thought of this type of sex? Sexual scenarios of all sorts generate strong emotional reactions: how many times have you heard people say "gross" at this or that image?

21 comments:

  1. I've been arguing for years that homophobia is a much more interesting human-science topic than homosexuality. It still seems to me that buggery is central to the issue.

    ReplyDelete
  2. Could it be as simple as the widespread revulsion that heteros feel at the thought of this type of sex?

    You mean religions simply codify the prejudices of their founders? Shocking! ;-)

    I suspect that there is a feedback effect at work, too. The less tolerant a society is of homosexuals, the more likely there are to be closet cases like Ted Haggard railing even more strongly against them, which makes the society even less tolerant.

    ReplyDelete
  3. Anonymous9:27 AM

    I'm with Jewish Atheist on this one.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Anonymous11:33 AM

    "The less tolerant a society is of homosexuals, the more likely there are to be closet cases like Ted Haggard railing even more strongly against them, which makes the society even less tolerant."

    I agree, islam full of closested feaks.

    ReplyDelete
  5. Anonymous12:36 PM

    "You mean religions simply codify the prejudices of their founders? Shocking!"

    There's more to it than that, JA. As John Derbyshire argues in the link posted by John (the Derb himself?), people tend to equate male homosexuality with anal sex - with some justification. Anal sex is something many people find intensely disgusting, more on aesthetic and hygienic grounds than for any traditional religious strictures.

    ReplyDelete
  6. Anonymous:

    LOL, I think you're projecting a little bit there.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Anonymous1:56 PM

    You know what's funny John? You spend the majority of that essay discussing sodomy, going as far as discussing how some cltures view the submissive as less than a man.

    Then, in the last few lines, you tell minorities to lie back and take it.

    Hilarious and a perfect example of right-wing populism or rule by lowest common denominator.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Anonymous2:58 PM

    JA, the point is that the anti-sodomy verses of the Bible still resonate in a way the anti-mixed-textile verses don't. There must be some reason for that. Some more fundamental force is driving it.

    As for "projection", yeah, I tried it a couple of times at an old girlfriend's coaxing. I could take or leave, but *she* clearly liked it for its taboo-breaking qualities.

    ReplyDelete
  9. Anonymous7:33 PM

    "There must be some reason for that. Some more fundamental force is driving it."

    The three reasons are gender belief system, authoritarianism, and social dominance orientation.

    http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2294/is_2000_June/ai_66011966

    ReplyDelete
  10. Then, in the last few lines, you tell minorities to lie back and take it. - Walker Purple

    I wish people wouldn't always be so darn clever in paraphrasing. I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with your take on Derb's take on homophobia, I just don't even know what you're talking about. Last few lines? Lie back and take something? Take what?

    This is some clever rape metaphor and I'm far too [whatever the hip word for the blue-indigo-violet range of the autism spectrum is] to get it.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Anonymous9:12 PM

    "As for "projection", yeah, I tried it a couple of times at an old girlfriend's coaxing. I could take or leave, but *she* clearly liked it for its taboo-breaking qualities."

    Still got her #?

    ReplyDelete
  12. JA, the point is that the anti-sodomy verses of the Bible still resonate in a way the anti-mixed-textile verses don't. There must be some reason for that. Some more fundamental force is driving it.

    I agree with that 100%.

    As for "projection", yeah, I tried it a couple of times at an old girlfriend's coaxing. I could take or leave, but *she* clearly liked it for its taboo-breaking qualities.

    I don't think that's typical. Just look at how much anal there is in straight porn. Most guys must at least not be totally disgusted by it.

    (As for myself, meh. Not a fan. But it doesn't totally gross me out either.)

    ReplyDelete
  13. Anonymous7:23 AM

    "There must be some reason for that. Some more fundamental force is driving it."

    The three reasons are gender belief system, authoritarianism, and social dominance orientation.

    http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m2294/is_2000_June/ai_66011966


    If that were so, you'd expect to find people with those traits to view lesbians more favourably than gay males. That may be so, but the article doesn't argue for it. It appears not to differentiate the two groups - a common but stupid approach.

    ReplyDelete
  14. Anonymous8:46 AM

    Mulling over what Derbyshire wrote, and hearing the usual horror stories about prison, etc., I wonder if buggery is the reason for homosexuality. Without it, I wonder if the gays would be more likely to display bisexuality, occasionally sleeping with a man but also having wives/girlfriends. The idea being that after a man has carried out such an act, he is forever changed and has a modified version of gender roles. Who is "the man" becomes a function, not of what we are born to be, but who is being dominated (all the time, or temporarily) and which acts one finds most pleasurable.

    Without buggery, men pleasure each other in less traumatic ways (including the intercrural sex on the urns). Thus there is none of that pleasure-trauma duality, or pleasure-thru-trauma process, or whatever, that goes on in the heads of buggery fanciers that the rest of us don't understand.

    Plenty of older cultures seem to have tolerated male bisexuality without tolerating buggery. The question is, did they tolerate homosexuality as we understand it today? If a man were in love with a man and shared pleasure with, would it be expected that he would eschew women and not father any children? I'm sure it varied from culture to culture, but I'll wager that toleration of actual homosexuality is historically quite rare.

    What worries me: buggery starts out in the minds of most boys as an offensive threat, plain and simple. That's the way it was when I was in junior high. Then some of the boys, who I'll wager are bisexual, decide they're going to give it a try because of our weird post-60s "everything forbidden is mandatory". Then they suddenly don't seem to be interested in girls any more, perhaps because they've been drawn into an eccentric mens-only subculture which is they feel the only place they can be accepted. But is the notion that buggery is a basic assault on human dignity still hanging in the background? Can that be the reason female "tourists" often wind up leading basically heterosexual lifestyles while the male "tourists" seem to emigrate from heterosexuality?

    And no, I don't have any statistics to back this up, just hunches.

    ReplyDelete
  15. Anonymous10:59 AM

    Yes! Fіnallу someonе writеѕ about top insuranсе compаnieѕ.

    tesco car insurance application - car insurance quotes ct

    my website; cheap auto insurance

    ReplyDelete
  16. Anonymous8:53 PM

    Hi thеre! This blοg рost could not be wгitten any bettеr!
    Reading through this ρost reminds mе of my previοus roommatе!
    He always keρt preachіng about this. I'll send this article to him. Pretty sure he will have a good read. I appreciate you for sharing!

    Here is my site :: universal life insurance

    ReplyDelete
  17. Anonymous11:07 AM

    Нey there just wanted to give you a quicκ heaԁs uр.
    The text in youг artіcle seеm to bе running off thе
    scгeen in Chrome. I'm not sure if this is a format issue or something to do with internet browser compatibility but I figured I'd pοst to let you knοw.

    The layout look gгеat though! Ηope уou get the issue reѕolved soon.
    Thanks ripplefly inc -
    Rippln - rippln mobile

    Feel frеe to surf to my page - rippln mobile

    ReplyDelete
  18. Anonymous9:56 PM

    I visited several sites however the audio feature for audio songs current at this
    website is really wonderful.

    My website - yellow pages ad for appliance repair Lutz

    ReplyDelete
  19. Anonymous9:37 PM

    Fantastic post however I was wondering if you could write a litte more on this topic?
    I'd be very grateful if you could elaborate a little bit further. Appreciate it!

    Also visit my web site; yellow pages ad for appliance repair Clearwater FL

    ReplyDelete
  20. Anonymous10:42 PM

    Hey there! This is my 1st comment here so I just wanted to give a quick shout out and tell you I truly enjoy reading your blog posts.

    Can you suggest any other blogs/websites/forums that go
    over the same subjects? Thanks a lot!

    Also visit my website: appliance repair Safety Harbor FL

    ReplyDelete
  21. Anonymous10:36 AM

    I lоѵe yοur blog.. νеry nice
    colors & theme. Did you design thіѕ wеbsite уourѕelf oг dіd you hirе someone tο do it for you?

    Plz respond as I'm looking to create my own blog and would like to find out where u got this from. kudos

    my homepage - raspberry ketone pills reviews

    ReplyDelete

Are gun owners mentally ill?

  Some anti-gun people think owning a gun is a sign of some kind of mental abnormality. According to General Social Survey data, gun owners ...